Exploring Developmental Pathways for Permaculture Designers with Jason Gerhardt (E25)

I’m sure you’ll enjoy this rich, deep yet lively second conversation with Jason Gerhardt (first chat was here). Jason directs the USA’s Permaculture Institute and Real Earth Design. As it turns out we continue exploring the ordering framework I introduced in Episode 24.

Here’s the framework diagram, slightly updated thanks to a suggestion from Bill Reed. Or download as pdf here.

Oh yeah I also mention this recent recreate of Making Permaculture Stronger’s purpose that Joel Glanzberg helped me with and that uses the pattern I explored with Bill Reed here:

MPS inspires creative exploration and dialogue around permaculture design in a way that develops our ability to think and act creatively as and with community to effect the large scale systemic change we need.

Oh yeah Jason mention this amazing white paper on the four levels of Regenerative Agriculture by Ethan Roland Soloviev & Gregory Landua. I can’t believe I haven’t read this yet. Do check it out if you’ve not seen it and leave a comment telling me what you make of it.

I also mentioned the Permaculture Home Garden by Linda Woodrow.


  1. Great chat. Exciting to hear Jason announce his efforts toward curriculum pathways!

    “Find mentors and follow them around” golden tip!

    “Permaculture is an internal process”
    In here lies the key!

    If we dont really know why we’re doing a thing it will never be its essence. And in the case of permaculture alot of people feel the power, the wattage eminating from its essence just waiting to be practiced and nourished and ushered into evolution. Though we don’t even know it’s full potential!

    Thanks again for all this epicly thought and soul provoking work you are doing Dan and, of course Jason and all guests and friends of MPS!

  2. Hey Dan – only just discovered your podcasts … or podcasts generally … hangs head in shame) – really enjoyed this one, particularly as my wife and I are in the throes of our (first) PDC which we are doing online given noone would be foolish enough to volunteer minding a near 3 year old for 2 whole weeks :-). The “what now?” question upon completion is something that is emerging as a constant thread amongst the participants.
    The previous podcast(s) with Dave Jacke were just as spot on – there is so much talk of permaculture being a “design science” but no real discussion or guidance as to how one goes about it in practice!
    Anyway, greatly enjoying the podcasts, your insights and infectious enthusiasm – cheers for your efforts 🙂

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